A nuanced discussion about the science

It is past time for a round table discussion #allesaufdentisch

Kentucky Senator Rand Paul took issue with the vaccine mandate during a Senate Health, Education, Labor, and Pensions Committee hearing to examine school re-openings during Covid-19. Here are some quotes from Rand Paul taken from The Hill’s youtube video posted yesterday:

Are you familiar with an Israeli study that had 2.5 million patients and found that the vaccinated group was actually 7 times more likely to get infected with Covid than the people that had gotten Covid naturally?

[America’s Health and Human Services (HHS) Secretary Becerra was unfamiliar with that study] Here is the Israeli study discussed: Comparing SARS-CoV-2 natural immunity to vaccine-induced immunity: reinfections versus breakthrough infections. For the study, researchers analyzed anonymized Electronic Health Records, a database which covers records for 2.5 million people in Israeli, spanning March 1st 2020 to August 14th 2021

You think you might want to be [familiar with the study] if you’re going to travel the country insulting the millions of Americans including NBA star Jonathan Isaac. They have had Covid, have recovered, and they look at a study with 2.5 million people and say: ‘Well you know what, it looks like my immunity is as good as the vaccine.’ In a free country, maybe I ought to be able to make that decision. Instead, you’ve chosen to travel the country calling people like Jonathan Isaac and others, myself included, "‘flat-earthers”. We find that very insulting. It goes against the science. Are you a doctor or a medical doctor?

[HHS Secretary Becerra replies that he has worked over 30 years on Health Policy]

You are not a medical doctor. Do you have a science degree? [answer unseen & unheard] And yet you travel the country, calling people ‘flat-earthers’ who have had Covid, looked at studies of millions of people, and made their own personal decision that their immunity they naturally acquired is sufficient. But you presume to somehow tell over 100 million Americans who have survived Covid that we have no right to determine our own medical care? You alone are on high, and you’ve made these decisions: a lawyer with no scientific background, and no medical degree? This is an arrogance coupled with an authoritarianism that is unseemly and un-American. You sir are the one ignoring the science. The vast preponderance of scientific studies - dozens and dozens - show robust, long lasting immunity after Covid infection. Even the CDC does not recommend measles vaccine if you have measles immunity. The same was true for smallpox. But you ignore history and science to shame the ‘flat-earthers’ as you call them. You should be ashamed of yourself and apologize to the American people for being dishonest about naturally acquired immunity. You want more people to choose vaccination. So do I. You want to lessen vaccine hesitancy - so do I. Quit lying to people about naturally acquired immunity. Quit lording it over people, acting as if these people are deplorable. Try persuasion instead of government cudgels. Try humility instead of arrogance. Try freedom instead of coercion. But most of all try understanding that there’s no more basic medical right than deciding what we inject into our bodies. [You’ve heard today] that millions of people in a study prove, show, without a doubt that there’s a great deal of immunity from getting [Covid] naturally. Do you want to apologize to the 100 million Americans who suffered through Covid, survived, have immunity - yet you want to hold them down and vaccinate them. Do you want to apologize for calling those people ‘flat-earthers’?

[HHS Secretary Becerra response at 3:07 min about his team going by results on the ground]

except for the dozens and dozens of studies, in fact most if not all of the studies show robust immunity from getting the disease naturally. The CDC says if you’ve had measles and have immunity you don’t have to be vaccinated. The same was true of smallpox. You’re selectively doing this because you want us to submit to your will. You have no scientific background, no scientific degrees, you aren’t really concerned about 100 million Americans who’ve had the disease. You just want to tell us ‘do as you’re told’. That’s what you’re telling us. You want to mandate this on all of us. You’re going to tell us if I have 100 employees, you’re going to put me out of business with a $700,000 fine if I don’t obey what you think is the science. Don’t you understand that it’s presumptuous for you to be in charge of all the science? You ever heard of second opinion? I can’t go to my doctor and ask my doctor’s opinion?

Many thousands of doctors believe that Senator Rand Paul and everyone else should indeed be able to consult their personal doctors. At last count (as of 4:45pm ET on October 1st) over 8,600 doctors and scientists have signed the Rome Declaration.

https://doctorsandscientistsdeclaration.org/

It reads in part:

We the physicians of the world, united and loyal to the Hippocratic Oath, recognizing the profession of medicine as we know it is at a crossroad, are compelled to declare the following:

WHEREAS, it is our utmost responsibility and duty to uphold and restore the dignity, integrity, art and science of medicine;

WHEREAS, there is an unprecedented assault on our ability to care for our patients;

WHEREAS, public policy makers have chosen to force a “one size fits all” treatment strategy, resulting in needless illness and death, rather than upholding fundamental concepts of the individualized, personalized approach to patient care which is proven to be safe and more effective;

WHEREAS, physicians and other health care providers working on the front lines, utilizing their knowledge of epidemiology, pathophysiology and pharmacology, are often first to identify new, potentially life saving treatments;

WHEREAS, physicians are increasingly being discouraged from engaging in open professional discourse and the exchange of ideas about new and emerging diseases, not only endangering the essence of the medical profession, but more importantly, more tragically, the lives of our patients;

WHEREAS, thousands of physicians are being prevented from providing treatment to their patients, as a result of barriers put up by pharmacies, hospitals, and public health agencies, rendering the vast majority of healthcare providers helpless to protect their patients in the face of disease. Physicians are now advising their patients to simply go home (allowing the virus to replicate) and return when their disease worsens, resulting in hundreds of thousands of unnecessary patient deaths, due to failure-to-treat

NOW THEREFORE, IT IS:

RESOLVED, that the physician-patient relationship must be restored. The very heart of medicine is this relationship, which allows physicians to best understand their patients and their illnesses, to formulate treatments that give the best chance for success, while the patient is an active participant in their care.

RESOLVED, that the political intrusion into the practice of medicine and the physician/patient relationship must end. Physicians, and all health care providers, must be free to practice the art and science of medicine without fear of retribution, censorship, slander, or disciplinary action, including possible loss of licensure and hospital privileges, loss of insurance contracts and interference from government entities and organizations – which further prevent us from caring for patients in need. More than ever, the right and ability to exchange objective scientific findings, which further our understanding of disease, must be protected

RESOLVED, that physicians must defend their right to prescribe treatment, observing the tenet FIRST, DO NO HARM. Physicians shall not be restricted from prescribing safe and effective treatments. These restrictions continue to cause unnecessary sickness and death. The rights of patients, after being fully informed about the risks and benefits of each option, must be restored to receive those treatments.

If you qualify, please consider also signing: https://doctorsandscientistsdeclaration.org/

Voice of the vaccine hesitant

Senator Rand Paul mentioned NBA star (Orlando Magic) Jonathan Isaac during the Senate hearing. Here is Jonathan Isaac’s response to sports media which went viral last week, which I sourced from https://rumble.com/embed/vki47t/?pub=bdqze (Near Death Experiment’s rumble account):

I’ve had COVID, in the past. Our understanding of antibodies, of natural immunity has changed a great deal from the onset of the pandemic, and it’s still evolving.

I understand that the vaccine would help if you catch COVID, and you’ll be able to have less symptoms from contracting it. But with me having COVID in the past and having antibodies, with my current age group and physical fitness level, it’s not necessarily a fear of mine.

Taking the vaccine would decrease my chances of  having a severe reaction but it does open me up to the, albeit rare chance, but the possibility of having an adverse reaction to the vaccine itself.

I don’t believe that being unvaccinated means being infected or being vaccinated means uninfected. You can still catch COVID with or without having the vaccine.

I would say honestly, the craziness of it all, in terms of not being able to say that it should be everybody’s fair choice without being demeaned or ‘talked crazy’ to doesn’t make one comfortable to do what said person is telling them to do.

Yeah, I would say that’s a couple of the reasons that I would say that I’m hesitant at this time, but at the end of the day, I don’t feel that it is anyone’s reason to come out and say they is why and this is not why. It should just be their decision.

You know, loving your neighbor’s not just loving those that agree with you or look like you or move in the same way that you do—it’s loving those who don’t.

[Sports Media asks Jonathan Isaac to comment on Rolling Stone article about the NBA’s antivaxxers and asks if he was misquoted in their article]

I was pretty badly misrepresented in the Rolling Stone article. And because of that I can understand anyone who says they don’t transparently or overtly trust the media. In a frustrated tweet yesterday I said that true journalism is dying:

And with that I would say that I appreciate every one of you: those that try their best to correctly share the thoughts, ideas, and the heart of the people they are asking questions of. I am not anti-vaxx. I’m not anti-medicine. I’m not anti-science. I didn’t come to my current vaccination status by studying Black history or watching Donald Trump press conferences

I have nothing but the utmost respect for every health care worker and person in Orlando and all across the world that have worked tirelessly to keep us safe. My mom has worked in health care for a really long time. I thank God, I am grateful that I live in a society where vaccines are possible. We can protect ourselves and have the means to protect ourselves. But with that being said it is my belief that the vaccine status of every person should be their own choice - completely up to them -

without bullying, without being pressured, without being forced into doing so.

I’m not ashamed to say that I’m uncomfortable with taking the vaccine at this time. I think that we’re all different. We all come from different places. We’ve all have had different experiences, and hold dear to different beliefs. What it is that you do with your body when it comes to putting medicine in there should be your choice. Free of the ridicule and the opinion of others. -Jonathan Isaac

We’ve been missing a nuanced discussion around individuals with vaccine hesitancy. Are they justified to still be hesitant?

Is the science settled?

The science isn’t settled. Open data is startling.

Whistleblower reports and data leaked from the CMS Medicare Tracking System servers suggest we are actually undercounting vaccine injury (Around 18% of Americans are on Medicare).

https://rumble.com/vn12v1-attorney-thomas-renz-we-got-them.-fact-check-this-all-new-whistleblower-inf.html (start at 4 min) [Deaths within 14 days of getting one of the vaccines in America are considered to be unvaccinated deaths. Read wording under Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) table here on page 3: https://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/volumes/70/wr/pdfs/mm7034e5-H.pdf]

Medical treatments with superior efficacy

Are there medical treatments demonstrating better efficacy than the vaccines? We should be able to have that discussion. Data leaked from the CMS Medicare Tracking System servers suggest “yes” (slide below). And also that our Health Regulatory Authorities (who we already know are funded by the Pharmaceutical Industry) are all already aware of this fact.

There is compelling evidence and testimonials from doctors and scientists that have been suppressed, but that people are very interested in hearing. This is evidenced by #allesaufdentisch still trending on twitter in Germany for its third day today

It is past time for a round table discussion. Engage here: https://www.allesaufdentisch.tv/spike-proteine.html

Questioning must be allowed and dialog encouraged

Dissent is a human right. Dialog is the only solution. Any other options are unacceptable in a Democracy. Many countries are currently not moving in a Democratic direction. Dr. Nils Melzer serves as the United Nations Special Rapporteur on Torture and other Cruel, Inhuman or Degrading Treatment or Punishment. He is a professor of international law at the University of Glasgow and holds the Human Rights Chair at the Geneva Academy of International Humanitarian Law and Human Rights in Switzerland.

We the people of democracies throughout the world must be on alert. Democracy is threatened.

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References provided by Near Death Experiment’s rumble account in order of appearance:
Had COVID? You’ll probably make antibodies for a lifetime. - Nature Journal
Natural immunity to covid is powerful. Policymakers seem afraid to say so. -The Washington Post
VAERS COVID Vaccine Adverse Event Reports through September 17, 2021 - Open VAERS CDC says fully vaccinated people spread the Delta variant and should wear masks: ‘This new science is worrisome’. - Business Insider